"Hot Lips" Dimes Now Considered Die Clashes

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Paul
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"Hot Lips" Dimes Now Considered Die Clashes

#1 Unread post by Paul »

"Hot Lips" Dimes Now Considered Die Clashes
by CONECA Variety Attributer,
James Wiles

Originally attributed as doubled dies by John Wexler and published by Ken Potter in Numismatic News, "hot lips" dimes were subsequently cataloged as doubled dies by CONECA as well. I had questions initially but was willing to agree with other attributers and list them as DDOs, until more information surfaced. It wasn't long until several additional specimens from varying dates and die states were reported. It was discovered that all had die clash marks and when overlays were made, the reverse design matched the doubled areas. I have now seen enough examples for me to conclude that the doubling is most likely the result of die clashing/abrasion and not from a doubled die. Other attributers are re-evaluating their positions. I remain open, but until I see an example without die clashing, I am no longer listing them in the CONECA Die Variety files. In fact, those that had been listed, have now been removed. See my study notes, overlays, and photos in the Roosevelt Dime E-Book.
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Re: "Hot Lips" Dimes Now Considered Die Clashes

#2 Unread post by Daniel »

Thanks for the update.

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Re: "Hot Lips" Dimes Now Considered Die Clashes

#3 Unread post by Paul »

I'm going to do my own overlay also
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Re: "Hot Lips" Dimes Now Considered Die Clashes

#4 Unread post by DSCoins »

Out of curiosity, what happens to any coins that may have graded as a doubled die? No I don't have one but am just curious.

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Re: "Hot Lips" Dimes Now Considered Die Clashes

#5 Unread post by Paul »

That's a very good question......
I will have to ask someone higher up
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Re: "Hot Lips" Dimes Now Considered Die Clashes

#6 Unread post by Earle42 »

Paul, could you please put a link to he E-book you mention?
Common grading company shortcomings & resulting co$tly mi$take$ to collectors (using Kennedy No FG halves):
https://tinyurl.com/y7rksxu8

How much squash would a sasquatch squash if a sasquatch would squash squash?

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Re: "Hot Lips" Dimes Now Considered Die Clashes

#7 Unread post by Paul »

Is this what you're looking for?

LINK
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Re: "Hot Lips" Dimes Now Considered Die Clashes

#8 Unread post by Daniel »

An already slabbed coin is just that, it will remain in the slab unlabeled but once word is out no one will buy it as a hot lips, this isn't the first time for this to happen.

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Re: "Hot Lips" Dimes Now Considered Die Clashes

#9 Unread post by Earle42 »

Paul:

This is what I was asking the link for:
See my study notes, overlays, and photos in the Roosevelt Dime E-Book.
Common grading company shortcomings & resulting co$tly mi$take$ to collectors (using Kennedy No FG halves):
https://tinyurl.com/y7rksxu8

How much squash would a sasquatch squash if a sasquatch would squash squash?

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Re: "Hot Lips" Dimes Now Considered Die Clashes

#10 Unread post by Paul »

Earle42 wrote: Sun May 09, 2021 11:17 pm Paul:

This is what I was asking the link for:
See my study notes, overlays, and photos in the Roosevelt Dime E-Book.
I'm going to have to search this one out.......

Here's an image of the overlay I made...... I don't see it, but what do I know
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Re: "Hot Lips" Dimes Now Considered Die Clashes

#11 Unread post by Paul »

Here it is:

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Re: "Hot Lips" Dimes Now Considered Die Clashes

#12 Unread post by Daniel »

What overlays was he looking at, could the reverse clash have been slight rotated/

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Re: "Hot Lips" Dimes Now Considered Die Clashes

#13 Unread post by Paul »

Very possible Daniel
I'm going to have to dig into his e-book when I have time…
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Re: "Hot Lips" Dimes Now Considered Die Clashes

#14 Unread post by Earle42 »

Thanks Paul
Before I had asked you for the link, I took every link and sub link at that location and found no overlay. Thanks for your overlay.

Rotated:

Looks like it. Otherwise it doesn't line up with the former "hot lips" designation picture.
Common grading company shortcomings & resulting co$tly mi$take$ to collectors (using Kennedy No FG halves):
https://tinyurl.com/y7rksxu8

How much squash would a sasquatch squash if a sasquatch would squash squash?

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Re: "Hot Lips" Dimes Now Considered Die Clashes

#15 Unread post by Paul »

Okay, instead of doing what I was supposed to be doing for the last few hours, I searched all over myself........ NOTHING!

I use the photo editing software called "Gimp", it's a little more complicated but, once you learn it you love it.
I spun that reverse overlay 360°, I still don't see anything matching anywhere.

Conclusion: ??

I was just posting what I read on the site....................
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Re: "Hot Lips" Dimes Now Considered Die Clashes

#16 Unread post by Paul »

This is only been found on the 1964 Denver mint issues?
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Re: "Hot Lips" Dimes Now Considered Die Clashes

#17 Unread post by DSCoins »

Paul, I don't see it either. I spent a good 1 1/2 looking at your overlay and I just can't see it. The only thing I can think of which might fit, is if some how the clash was off center a little to K9. Other than that I'm going crazy trying to match it up.
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Re: "Hot Lips" Dimes Now Considered Die Clashes

#18 Unread post by Earle42 »

I also spent time on your overlay Paul, and I decided the best way to try to figure it out was to make an overlay myself. I also added a colored pic of the hotlips. I made the REV overlay colored to make a better contrast and cannot make the design match.
Click for Hi-Res
Click for Hi-Res
Common grading company shortcomings & resulting co$tly mi$take$ to collectors (using Kennedy No FG halves):
https://tinyurl.com/y7rksxu8

How much squash would a sasquatch squash if a sasquatch would squash squash?

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Re: "Hot Lips" Dimes Now Considered Die Clashes

#19 Unread post by Paul »

Have you read this:

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Re: "Hot Lips" Dimes Now Considered Die Clashes

#20 Unread post by Earle42 »

Good read - thanks for this.
Common grading company shortcomings & resulting co$tly mi$take$ to collectors (using Kennedy No FG halves):
https://tinyurl.com/y7rksxu8

How much squash would a sasquatch squash if a sasquatch would squash squash?

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