real or fake?
18mm
3.7 grams
Heres a question I have been meaning to ask regarding Julius Caesar.
Is the obverse legend a telltell sign of these fakes ?
for example ,some of the lettering not uniform sizes, and which letters are under which of the elephants legs?( for example the S in Caesar under one of the legs( the 2nd one from the right.. whereas alot of Julius Caesar coins has the E or(2nd) A under the leg?
and what about the elephant ear canal
Julius Caesar denarius I am thinking of getting....
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Here's a link to how to post a topic with images in our community https://coinauctionshelp.com/welcome-to ... community/
___________________________________________________________________________________________________________
You also agree to follow these guidelines. You must agree to these rules to be a member of this forum. NO SPAM! Spam is deleted within minutes, no spam will ever be left in our community.
1. Post a front and back image of your coin with a specific question about what you’re seeing or asking about and one coin per topic.
2. Please remove coin from the holder unless it’s US or an official mint case or unless it is graded by a grading service.
3. Images should be taken by a camera or cell phone camera, we ask that members don’t use images through a microscope screen.
4. Always start your own topic, please don’t ask about your coin or post your coin in someone else’s coin topic.
5. Do not send private messages about your coin unless an Admin ask you too and the same for sending emails through the board.
6. No spam. Do not post any links to your coin or other non-coin websites.
7. Always be respectful even if something makes you upset or you don’t agree with a member. You can always get a second opinion elsewhere. If you have an issue then politely ask an admin in an PM. PM’s are for issues, technical and personal, but not for coin questions (refer to number 5 on this list). Our community is not a soap box for complaining or drama, so please refrain from doing so here.[/size]
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- Coin Wizz
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Julius Caesar denarius I am thinking of getting....
Last edited by RomanGreekCoins on Sat May 19, 2018 10:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.
- mhonzell
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Re: Julius Caesar denarius I am thinking of getting....
First, there is a lot of variation to this coin depending on who the engravers were:
Coins have been made since about 650 BC. Counterfeiting has been around since about 649 BC.
So, part of the dilemma is determining if you have an ancient counterfeit or a modern counterfeit. People actually collect the ancient ones.
There were two basic ways of counterfeiting ancient coins in the early days:
The first was to cover a base metal core with a thin layer of precious metal and then strike it between engraved dies. If the coating was seamless, the dies of good quality, and the weight of the finished piece close enough to the official standard, such coins might pass as genuine. They are known as fourées, from a French word meaning “stuffed.” Most of the Mark Antony legion coins fall in this category.
The second way was to make clay molds from an original coin, and then pour molten metal into the molds, usually leaded copper alloy. Ceramic molds could be mass-produced cheaply, so low-value copper coins could be counterfeited profitably. There was a chronic shortage of small change in ancient economies, so even poor quality fakes were accepted in markets for lack of anything better. Authorities tended to ignore such forgeries, even when they enforced savage penalties against counterfeiting precious metal coins. Hence, you may have a counterfeit coin that was cast in ancient times.
The coin you are looking at appears to have areas that indicate it was cast. Especially the areas under the devices on each side.
So, how do you tell an ancient fake from a modern fake?
Pick-up points.
Each die, cast or strike, will have unique features that identify a coin's maker. I do not know enough on this coin to tell you what pick-up points to look for, but if you thumb through the varieties of this coin and find a match on Forvm or WildWind, then they may be able to provide more detail.
Notice how some have strong "dots" where lines come together in the legend. That was an engraver technique on these early coins of the Republic to join lines. They just didn't have a lot of skill, or they were lazy.Coins have been made since about 650 BC. Counterfeiting has been around since about 649 BC.
So, part of the dilemma is determining if you have an ancient counterfeit or a modern counterfeit. People actually collect the ancient ones.
There were two basic ways of counterfeiting ancient coins in the early days:
The first was to cover a base metal core with a thin layer of precious metal and then strike it between engraved dies. If the coating was seamless, the dies of good quality, and the weight of the finished piece close enough to the official standard, such coins might pass as genuine. They are known as fourées, from a French word meaning “stuffed.” Most of the Mark Antony legion coins fall in this category.
The second way was to make clay molds from an original coin, and then pour molten metal into the molds, usually leaded copper alloy. Ceramic molds could be mass-produced cheaply, so low-value copper coins could be counterfeited profitably. There was a chronic shortage of small change in ancient economies, so even poor quality fakes were accepted in markets for lack of anything better. Authorities tended to ignore such forgeries, even when they enforced savage penalties against counterfeiting precious metal coins. Hence, you may have a counterfeit coin that was cast in ancient times.
The coin you are looking at appears to have areas that indicate it was cast. Especially the areas under the devices on each side.
So, how do you tell an ancient fake from a modern fake?
Pick-up points.
Each die, cast or strike, will have unique features that identify a coin's maker. I do not know enough on this coin to tell you what pick-up points to look for, but if you thumb through the varieties of this coin and find a match on Forvm or WildWind, then they may be able to provide more detail.
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- Coin Wizz
- Posts: 202
- Joined: Sat Feb 24, 2018 2:08 pm
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Re: Julius Caesar denarius I am thinking of getting....
So you think it was cast....Did you notice casting bubbles.... I didnt see .. not sure....
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