False Doubling

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mhonzell
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False Doubling

#1 Unread post by mhonzell » Fri Feb 14, 2014 9:55 am

I know this has been discussed a billion times, so please ignore if you've already got it down pat.

Many times Daniel points out that what we (me included) think is doubling is either Abraded Die or Strike Doubling.

Abraded Die is the result of a mint employee polishing a die with grit to remove indications of a die clash. Polishing the surface is performed with a flexible surface (such as a fingertip) and results in uneven pressure, especially where surfaces are depressed into the die. This polishing wears off the sharp edge between the flat surface and the indentation. Now, when the die is used metal flows into this angled edge area and creates a "ghost" of the item. Similarily, Die Deterioration, can result in ghosts as those same egdes wear away over time.

Strike Doubling is caused by the die moving slightly as the pressure is released after striking the planchet. The actual imprint on the coin is the lower, "doubled" imprint. But, due to the die movement, as the pressure is released, the die cuts into the raised surface, displacing the object and leaving a very flat "doubling" with a sharp shelf-like edge. That movement is never exactly the same on two coins. So, it is considered damage, not doubling.

Here's my rendition of the process:
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Re: False Doubling

#2 Unread post by mhonzell » Fri Feb 14, 2014 11:43 am

Okay... quiz time... widegrin

Is the following coin showing:
1) Abraded Die
2) Strike Doubling
3) Die Doubling (edited: maybe I should have said "Doubled Die")
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Last edited by mhonzell on Fri Feb 14, 2014 1:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: False Doubling

#3 Unread post by fwd » Fri Feb 14, 2014 12:02 pm

...I'm gonna go out on a short limb here and say............none of the above, it be a doubled die on account I thunk I saw some notching... widegrin

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Re: False Doubling

#4 Unread post by mhonzell » Fri Feb 14, 2014 2:00 pm

Notching is a term related to doubling that is exhibited when a letter has squared off corners. The rounded edge runs into it's double and creates a notch in the character. (see below)

Strike doubling can give you a two-pointed corner, but not the notch.

With that... I'm not sure where you are seeing notching in that photo. Since I get this call wrong a lot, it would help if you point it out for me.
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Notching.jpg

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Re: False Doubling

#5 Unread post by mhonzell » Fri Feb 14, 2014 2:55 pm

Clarification on this stuff is always a bonus. Thanks!

I chose the picture for the quiz because I also thought it had machine doubling (strike doubling) and abraded die characteristics. But, if you look at the R in TRUST, you can see a definite split in the serifs on the right leg. Splits cannot be caused by Strike Doubling or Abraded Die. The coin is graded and labeled as a DDO as a result. So, most likely, it is all three.

Sorry the photo is fuzzy, but it is straight from eBay and what I'm typically working with when looking for a variety. Wanted to give realisitic conditions... widegrin

I chose the 1971 because it was a coin in contention. "All the leading authorities" have declared this as an abraded die. Cherrypickers Guide still lists it as a doubled die. It is "at the boundary" and requires each individual to make a decision on it. As a result, submitting it is iffy, at best. Look at the Y in LIBERTY (right side of leg.) There, the heavy abrasion is more evident and looks more like the typical "ghost" doubling.

I'm including a Jefferson nickel below with both Abraded Die and Die Deterioration that might help. Notice the doubling in both directions on the T. I think PALH1 describes this as "mushy."
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1971 Abraded Die.jpg
1971 Abraded Die.jpg (34.44 KiB) Viewed 3491 times
Jefferson Die Deterioration.jpg
Jefferson Die Deterioration.jpg (48.46 KiB) Viewed 3490 times

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Re: False Doubling

#6 Unread post by Daniel » Fri Feb 14, 2014 3:51 pm

Good idea to provide realistic situation photos :thumbsup:

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Re: False Doubling

#7 Unread post by fwd » Fri Feb 14, 2014 3:58 pm

I'm not sure where you are seeing notching in that photo.

...top and bottom of the "G" and the bottom of the "R" in 'in god we trust'

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Re: False Doubling

#8 Unread post by mhonzell » Fri Feb 14, 2014 4:09 pm

I'll have to give you the notching. I don't see it.

What I have found though is that the more experience you get at seeing these details, the easier it is to recognize them. Good job, fwd!

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Re: False Doubling

#9 Unread post by Daniel » Fri Feb 14, 2014 4:26 pm

I think he's talking about the top end, inside of the G and the leg of the R.

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Re: False Doubling

#10 Unread post by ave13co » Sun Jun 09, 2019 8:33 pm

I asked Daniel if I could upload a few images of more false doubling. Starting with two different 1969S Penny's and so on. The last one is a 1993 D penny. You might have to zoom in ...
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upl69a.jpg
upl69b.jpg
upl71.jpg
upl72.jpg
upl73.jpg
upl93.jpg
upl93a.jpg

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