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1909 S VBD with foreign material removed?

Posted: Sat Dec 08, 2018 10:10 pm
by dennisinokla
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I am finally retired with enough time on my hands to look at the pile of coins I have hoarded over the years.

I am new at the coin error game. I bought this penny from a local that advertised it as "improperly cleaned". It became a place holder in my collection. I have a beautifully slabbed 1909 S VBD that I claim is a $22,000 penny with a $20,000 staple scratch. LOL

In regards to this penny. The thought is perhaps someone had "electrically" eroded a piece from the penny while trying to clean it or perhaps had struck it with an electrode. That does not really make a lot of sense but in 109 years, anything is possible.

Upon closer inspection (several years after I obtained it), I think the injury may be due to a piece of cud or some other foreign material that may have been impressed into the penny during minting and eventually the foreign item fell out.

Here is why: The imprint does not push down the rim and missing letters, had it been an impact after mint, the letters should be shown as "smashed" or "blurred".

Anyway, before I send it off for grading, what do you think?

Re: 1909 S VBD with foreign material removed?

Posted: Sun Dec 09, 2018 9:07 am
by Daniel
My first impression is the coin has been stamped with something after mint. However, the images are to blurry and I need to see both sides of this coin.

Also I would be more concerned with authenticity than this mark. I can authenticate if you could show a clear image of the mint mark or consult my guide here
http://coinauctionshelp.com/Coin_Help_B ... e-idenify/

Also here's a video for helping you take better coin images.
https://youtu.be/-Bk2KYdgJeE

Re: 1909 S VBD with foreign material removed?

Posted: Sun Dec 09, 2018 10:10 am
by Paul
:welcome:

:agree: D

Re: 1909 S VBD with foreign material removed?

Posted: Sun Dec 09, 2018 4:59 pm
by dennisinokla
Thank you Daniel, I used your authenticity page and verified the coin is authentic with exception of verifying the "pimple" in the S which my eyes are not good enough to verify with my magnification. I will take a chance and send this to PCGS with my argument(s) which include the reveres opposite the imprint is very slightly bulged and the wheat stalks are more pronounced or sharper in that area even though it should be worn more in that area. I suggest the coin was imprinted a bit harder against the reverse die due to the foreign material causing a sharper, perhaps harder area that has resisted wear better than the rest.


Thank you for the info, I always worry about counterfeits. I am sure a person can make a very large collection of known counterfeits.

Re: 1909 S VBD with foreign material removed?

Posted: Sun Dec 09, 2018 7:01 pm
by Paul
D, ... do you think this would come back as "tooled" ??

Re: 1909 S VBD with foreign material removed?

Posted: Mon Dec 10, 2018 11:07 pm
by dennisinokla
Maybe. Only one way to find out. I will guess it will be graded as "damaged" if they do not buy into my foreign object fell out theory. I hate to lose it as a space holder in the book but I really want to know what the professionals think.

Re: 1909 S VBD with foreign material removed?

Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2018 7:28 am
by Daniel
You can't be certain P...

I do know the coin will come back a problem coin. I am a professional at this as is Paul and I am full time at it. I have to know these things or I can loose money. I believe it needs authenticated since that's more important than any other aspect of this coin.

Re: 1909 S VBD with foreign material removed?

Posted: Tue Dec 11, 2018 6:45 pm
by PetesPockets55
I believe the OP as far as genuine but it looks PSD to me at the LI of LIBERTY. Since whatever struck it (metal punch?) caused the reverse side to bulge away from the surface.
The area couldn't be pushed into the reverse die at the time the planchet was struck. The wheat lines would still be separate.
I would keep it as a filler. But that's just me, not wanting to spend the $ to get a details grade.

Re: 1909 S VBD with foreign material removed?

Posted: Wed Dec 12, 2018 10:40 am
by Paul
PetesPockets55 wrote:
Tue Dec 11, 2018 6:45 pm
I believe the OP as far as genuine but it looks PSD to me at the LI of LIBERTY. Since whatever struck it (metal punch?) caused the reverse side to bulge away from the surface.
The area couldn't be pushed into the reverse die at the time the planchet was struck. The wheat lines would still be separate.
I would keep it as a filler. But that's just me, not wanting to spend the $ to get a details grade.
:agree: