is this cast?

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RomanGreekCoins
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is this cast?

#1 Unread post by RomanGreekCoins » Thu Oct 18, 2018 1:06 am

just wondering
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Last edited by RomanGreekCoins on Thu Oct 18, 2018 7:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.



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mhonzell
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Re: is this cast?

#2 Unread post by mhonzell » Thu Oct 18, 2018 4:12 pm

While I don't think so, you didn't provide a diameter or weight and there are two photos of the same side.

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Re: is this cast?

#3 Unread post by RomanGreekCoins » Thu Oct 18, 2018 7:13 pm

oh sorry. here ya go
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Re: is this cast?

#4 Unread post by PetesPockets55 » Sat Oct 20, 2018 7:51 am

What is the weight and diameter?
Sometimes an image of the edge of the coin can help as well.
(Are the horses heads normal? They appear "cartoonish".)

Also, the obverse rim @ K-9 has a raised circle with "dimples" top and bottom of the circle that remind me of a casting sprue. Close in appearance and size to one of the perimeter dots, but slightly out of alignment and different size.

There are many ways to create fake coins. I'm strictly a hobbyist but have come across cast fakes the last two years that have opened my eyes to different things to look out for.

Some counterfeiters will use all kinds of trickery to separate you from your hard earned $ Money!!!
(See this thread on Counterfeits LINK .)
Cliff

Edit: Added the LINK, which I forgot originally.
Last edited by PetesPockets55 on Thu Oct 25, 2018 9:27 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: is this cast?

#5 Unread post by mhonzell » Sat Oct 20, 2018 10:34 am

Okay, I'm sure you found this coin in an auction group and you are wondering if it is fake.

I've stated before, I don't collect Greek coins or Roman Republic coins. I only collect Roman Imperials.
So, instead of having me identify the coin with no information provided, try giving me at least what the seller thinks it is. Or, put your posts in the forum on Ancient Coins at FORVM where there are experts on Greek and Republic coins.

This type of coin normally has the name of the ruler on the reverse just above ROMA, or instead of ROMA.
When it is without, it is attributed as ANONYMOUS. Because it is anonymous, it is dated around 157 BC. And, the horses were made with the extended head and are cartoonish.
The seller probably provided a date range, so this could help determine if it is fake.

The problem is the circle of dots. I found two examples of the coin and both had a solid circle, not dots. So, I probably have the wrong coin. (Note: the helmets don't exactly match.)


As to whether it is cast or not:
First, excellent photos.
Second, cast coins do not do well with cracks on the edge. So, Cliff is correct in pointing out the dot and crack at K-9. Look at the edge and see if it passes through the coin, or is filled in by the casting.
Is this medal alignment or coin alignment?

If medal alignment, the crack should be on the reverse at K-3, but that edge is dark and I can't tell.
If coin alignment, there is no crack at K-9 on the reverse making this cast.

Lastly, again, ancient coins are tooled or extravagantly cleaned before sold. This makes determining if a coin is cast by photo rather difficult unless very poorly done. So, if in doubt, don't buy it. There are a lot of fakes out there.
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Re: is this cast?

#6 Unread post by RomanGreekCoins » Wed Oct 24, 2018 10:29 pm

its

16.5 -17 mm
4 grams

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Re: is this cast?

#7 Unread post by PetesPockets55 » Thu Oct 25, 2018 9:32 am

RomanGreekCoins wrote:
Wed Oct 24, 2018 10:29 pm
its

16.5 -17 mm
4 grams
Thanks but how about Marks question: (Underlines are added by me)
"If medal alignment, the crack should be on the reverse at K-3, but that edge is dark and I can't tell.
If coin alignment, there is no crack at K-9 on the reverse making this cast."

So is it medal or coin alignment?
And an image of the edge of the coin at the area in question will be helpful as well.

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Re: is this cast?

#8 Unread post by mhonzell » Thu Oct 25, 2018 10:25 am

Do you already know the attribution?

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Re: is this cast?

#9 Unread post by RomanGreekCoins » Thu Oct 25, 2018 5:58 pm

ANCIENT ROME.

'ROMAN REPUBLIC'

BEAUTIFUL SILVER DENARIUS COIN.

" ANONYMOUS "

157 - 155 B.C.

*** BEAUTIFUL ''BIGA" ( 2 HORSE CHARIOT) ON REVERSE.

OBV: HELMETED HEAD OF ROMA rt.

REV: VICTORY IN BIGA rt; ROMA IN EX.

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Re: is this cast?

#10 Unread post by mhonzell » Thu Oct 25, 2018 7:14 pm

Thank you! Good to know I'm in the same ballpark on attribution.

Did you see the questions on medal alignment? You may not be able to answer if you are looking to buy the coin. But, would be a good question for seller. And, ask for photo of cracked edge.

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